Arnold Palmer Putting Courses

[squirerichard]

I asked yesterday, and the Rhyl competition will actually be in September rather than August, but there's no date yet. The council are producing a collage showing the old Arnold Palmer course and the current one they replaced it with, and I think they're planning it around the competition, although it seems as though it will only be a small display, for the hut.
He has a photo of the AP course with a view down the course, and one of the Top Hole. A local historian has photos of the Ffrith course, and probably the Rhyl one, which should have soon.

Wonderful source of information.

Thank you Mr Jones.

[Peter Jones]

I'll find out on Monday, what sort of photos the local historian has of the AP course that was at Prestatyn Ffrith Beach. I don't know, yet, about Rhyl's, but he does seem to have a postcard which may be of more use than the two multi-view ones I have. I had asked another local historian, who's also a councillor, but he didn't have anything.

I don't know what the feeling is about a Welsh Open venue, as it might be more likely to be occurrin' at Barry Island, but I think the main issue for Prestatyn would be having to close the course to the public, so they wanted to find out what time of year it would have to be. I didn't know what status it would have, as the tournaments in Blackpool and Manchester didn't tempt the southerners. They've got all those caravan parks and Pontins around Prestatyn, so the course is busy in the holiday season, and they wouldn't want to close if it was a very small field.

[Peter Jones]

I think there's another existing Arnold Palmer course to add to the list, at the Tan-Y-Mor Holiday Park, Pwllheli, on the Llyn Peninsular. It has the same background as the Craig Tara one at Ayr, as they were both former Butlins camps, originally built in 1947, and both rebranded as Haven in 1998, by Bourne Leisure, which includes both. I think the course is still there, and, if so, is at the front of the camp. They have a new adventure course, like some of the other Haven camps, but seems to be in a different part. From the photo I found, the old AP one has the standard obstacles, whereas the Craig Tara has some peculiar ones. I'll have a visit soon and get some photos. News of the Ffrith course will follow, as soon as I can get the local historian on the trumpet.

A Holiday on the Buses tour could be arranged. Alan, from the Presatayn course, used to work at Pontins, at one time, and they say the camp hasn't changed at all since it was filmed. I have a postcard of an eternit course that was at the camp, showing a hotel, no longer there, on the opposite side of the road, but it's an unposted one, so I don't know the date.

[Ace Man]

I can't see one here, Haven, Hafan Y Mor, Pwllheli LL53 6HJ
Is there another Haven near Pwllheli ?

[squirerichard]

A Holiday on the Buses tour could be arranged. Alan, from the Presatayn course, used to work at Pontins, at one time, and they say the camp hasn't changed at all since it was filmed. I have a postcard of an eternit course that was at the camp, showing a hotel, no longer there, on the opposite side of the road, but it's an unposted one, so I don't know the date.

Gor' Blimey!

[Peter Jones]

My mistake, as I wrote the wrong name. It's the Hafan Y Mor camp, which is on the list of courses. There's no details included there, but they've got a Facebook group with a list of links, and they say there's a course still there. I found a photo of the Arnold Palmer course, and, with being a Butlins, it would be an Arnold Palmer, anyway. I'll put the link up when I find it.

Unfortunately, the local historian says he hasn't found any photos or postcards in his collection of the Ffrith course, or Rhyl's. He only has an old sepia card of an older course, but says he'll let me know if he finds anything. He has a slide show soon about Rhyl's lost seaside attractions. Hopefully, someone he knows might have photos they might have photos they took before it all went. I'll try to get the two Rhyl photos as soon as I can, anyway.

[Peter Jones]

I checked up on what happened to the Arnold Palmer course at Pwllheli, and they say it's no longer there, and the new one was built about three years ago. There's a photo from it's Butlins days at http://www.photographersdirect.com/stoc ... aycamp.asp
There are also photos, on the crazy golf link, of other courses, including two of snow being cleared from the Arnold Palmer course at Whitby, aeriel shots of the Adventure and Mini at Hastings, Hastings Arnold Palmer, amongst others. A photo of the new adventure golf at the Pwllheli camp is shown at http://www.haven.com/parks/north_wales/ ... park.aspx#

The AP course may have been demolished at the same time as the ones at Butlins, Bognor and Minehead, although the new adventure courses at the Haven camps are different from the three Butlins courses. The information on miniaturegolfer needs changing, regarding the AP courses at Butlins, as those two were demolshed in 2008 to make way for funny adventure courses, where you have to bounce the ball of large cat scratching posts or barrels, to get around the corners - which you have to do on every hole. I know this, as I stayed in all three camps in late 2008, when only Skegness still had one of the old courses, shut at the time.

The Pwhelli camp, just this week, has had a £15m redevelopment approved by Gwynedd council, which will mean that 450 Butlins chalets will be demolished, to be replaced with space for 209 caravans and 75 lodge pitches. The newspaper report describes them as 'outdated', but the remaining Butlins camps still have all these old chalets.

[Peter Jones]

I'd take issue with Ant about piers not being able to pay their way. If that was the case, how comes the Germans have built fourteen new ones between 2000 and 2007? The private owners of Weston-super-Mare Grand pier, spent £40m on building a replacement for the pavillion that went up in flames after an employee left a chip pan on one morning. The media not getting their facts right are to blame. Even a question on Eggheads asked which pier had been destroyed by fire that year. The pier re-opened to the public two or three days after the fire, as the pier itself wasn't damaged, yet every newspaper continued to report that it had been destroyed.

In addition to that, the Labour government had a national pier-building programme, with several being considered around the coast. In Hastings, where the pier is swarming with thousands of rats, which could eventually destroy it, after the council's enforced closure due to the Asian businessmen who had run it into the ground, the Labour group called for the funds to be made available for restoration, but the Tories wouldn't have it, saying it wasn't a responsible use of Council Tax-payers money.

[Ace Man]

I found the piccy on your link Peter http://www.photographersdirect.com/buye ... id=1961378

[Peter Jones]

Thanks for finding the link. When I was asking the camp about the old course, they said they have a windmill on the present course, which they described as a family adventure golf. I'll have a look very soon.

[Ant]

I'd take issue with Ant about piers not being able to pay their way. If that was the case, how comes the Germans have built fourteen new ones between 2000 and 2007?

To clarify, I was talking about existing victorian piers.

Most are so structually unsound, I doubt there are many UK local authorities willing to pour millions of pounds into something that could easily be washed away in the next storm.

The big UK resorts where the piers are owned by the private sector can operate them on an even financial keel but there are many examples where they are literally on their last legs. Even if something like Brightons Palace Pier came up for sale, it would take a very brave investor to buy it even given its impressive turnover. Here today, possibly gone tomorrow. Fire, storms, boats adrift, IRA bombs - I suprised its still standing.

[Peter Jones]

Southend is an example of a council-owned pier, which despite being hit by a series of fires, they have always made the funds available to restore it. They're now giving it a £3m investment, adding a new restaurant.

Privately owned piers change hands all the time. It happens several times a year. Never mind Brighton's Palace Pier, even the West pier will eventually be totally rebuilt by the charitable trust that was set up to do so.

The privately owned ones aren't eligable for lottery funding, and some are at serious risk. Colwyn Bay's Victoria Pier is now falling into the sea, after the owner, who was the youngest pier owner, went bankrupt, but Weston-super-Mare's owners are commercial lawyers who are bought it for business rather than heritage reasons. It's a victorian structure that withstood the fire, and now has a new pavillion. The public vote they held, on which of the competing designs was most popular, was won by the one most similar to the previous pavillion, although it hadn't been their own favoured option, initially.

By the way, I think 'Eddie the Eagle' Edwards is due to be jumping off Worthing pier this weekend, in the Birdman Rally. They've got their annual Pier Day, next month, as well.

[Ant]

even the West pier will eventually be totally rebuilt by the charitable trust that was set up to do so.

No it won't! They haven't got any money.

I could tell you some stories about the West Pier and their proposed i360 (to fund the rebuilding) but I can't.

Suffice to say, that pier will never be rebuilt.